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Oahu defences...
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stbabslis



Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 26

PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Re the 8-inch railway at Fort Hase Kaneohe Bay. There is a photograph that shows 4 8-inch railway guns mounted on railway carriages on a short stretch of railroad. It may have been printed some years ago in the CDSG Journal.
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Kaneoheboy



Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 42
Location: Kaneohe, HI

PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In answer to your questions, I offer the following:

1. The "buried" telephone cable system was a "tactical" means of communication for the fire control command and control system and not to be confused with the post telephone system. Likewise, the commercial telephone lines were merely an adjunct means of communication for ordinary telephone calls, and vulnerable to being sabotaged or destroyed by bombardment.

Buried tactical communication cables that routed coast artillery communications were routed through small concrete cable huts equipped with junction terminals, and in some cases, manned switchboards. Battery commanders were able to communicate with their assigned position finding stations aka base end stations (BES). Communication within a battery was handled by a local fire control switchboard that routed telephone calls to the plotting room, gun emplacements, etc.

Small concrete "Switch-posts," equipped with terminal strips were situated along the cable routes, specifically to tie in telephone wire from field units to their higher command. Such telephone wire, was succeptable to damage by bombardment, sabotage, and agricultural machinery, and were a temporary means of communicating with tactical units in the field, other than wireless.

2. I have no information as to any U.S. Army troops accidentally cutting the buried cable in their assigned beaches on Dec. 7, 1941. I have heard of such cable being accidentally cut in agriculture fields by plantation machinery, but can not provide a source.

Oahu's North Shore tactical communication lines included cables located well above the shoreline to preclude any sabotage by enemy raiders.

Depending on the location, some tactical lines included 51 pair of wire as of August 1939. I am not privy to information as to whether cables were superceded by cable containg more pair of communication wire.

3. I am saying that the civilian telephone system was an adjunct to tactical "secure" communication lines; the commercial lines were not used for tactical control of troops.

Commercial telephone lines were at the mercy of saboteurs and destruction by artillery fire, friendly or otherwise, and were subject to being tapped.

4. With regards to the map, it has been altered from its original state by the person from whose estate I received it from. Gun batteries that have been penned in, were added by the previous owner. Your reference to Battery Sylvester is a good example of a battery that was manned and so-named after Dec. 7, 1941.

5. Searchlights: All positions shown on the map with a "P" were mobilization positions, any such position was to have been equipped with transportable 60-inch serachlights, such as 27-28P on Mokapu Peninsula. Those marked with an "F" after the numerical designator were fixed, normally on steel towers. I do not have information as to whether all portable searchlight positions shown on the map were provided with concrete pads for the lights, although the procedure was to build such pads.

All 60-inch portable searchlights were powered by portable generators; fixed light positions were provided with generator housings.

I have no information as to whether the searchlight positions were all manned prior to Dec. 7, 1941, as many positions were mobilization assignments.

6. Seacoast 60-inch searchlights were employed generally to illuminate ocean vessels, whereas those assigned to antiaircraft artillery units were used in conjunction with "sound locators" then supplemented by SCR-268 radar to locate aircraft at night and direct the searchlight beam to illuminate the target.

7. I have no info as to the expected life of searchlights in combat.

8. Dorrance and Gaines have written many articles published in the "Coast Defense Study Group's" quarterly Journal. You might check out Bennett's articles (a plug for me).

With regards to published books, Dorrance has written mainly about Fort Kamehameha, while Williford and McGovern's "Defenses of Pearl Harbor and Oahu 1907- 50" offer an excellant overall accounting of the island's coast defenses.

Additional books to consider for information on the subject of coast artillery are:

Terrance McGovern and Bolling Smith, "American Coastal Defenses 1885-1950;" "American Seacoast Defenses A Reference Guide," edited by Mark Berhow; Emanuel Raymond Lewis, "Seacoast Fortifications of the United States, An Introductory History." Smile
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Kaneoheboy



Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 42
Location: Kaneohe, HI

PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 8-inch railway guns emplaced at Fort Hase were originally placed atop hastily built railroad track, replaced by more permanent concrete emplacements that stablized the guns while firing. Wiliam C. Gaines has written an excellant essay on Oahu's Railway guns in the Journal.
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Z-man



Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 325
Location: CONNECTICUT

PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know much about Hawaii, but I'd like to say great debate and thanks for posting - this is our first thread to hit 3 pages!
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robdab



Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 20
Location: Toronto, Canada

PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2009 3:56 pm    Post subject: Oahu's Dec.7'41 Coastal Defenses Reply with quote

Z-man wrote:
I don't know much about Hawaii, but I'd like to say great debate and thanks for posting - this is our first thread to hit 3 pages!

Is that a challenge to try for 4, 5, .... ?

As many can tell you, I'd be quite happy to investigate Hawaii's defenses for as long as I can get knowledgeable answers.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Kaneoheboy,

John, I didn't realize that you were posting here under that name. Many thanks for your dedicated efforts in answering coastal defense questions about Hawaii. I hope that you don't mind my continuing to play "20 questions" ?

On the assumption that you don't, can you tell me anything wrt gas defenses at Oahu's CAC sites on Dec.7'41 ? I realize that open guns can't have been protected but I had wondered if there was a list of which batteries already had gas-proof plotting rooms and magazines etc. on that Sunday morning ? Were any observation end stations so protected ?
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Kaneoheboy



Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 42
Location: Kaneohe, HI

PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2009 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob, Off hand, the only battery that I know for sure was Harlow, as listed on the Report of Completed Works Form 1. The gasproofing was done in 1931. Most likely the others were retrofitted with gasproofing equipment as well, I haven't had the opportunity to study them. Perhaps another member of the forum can comment on this.

As for observation stations aka position finding stations, I have not seen any gasproofing of these structures in the eight examples I have inspected.
Most were post Dec. 7, 1941.

I will be offline for awhile due to a eye surgery for a torn retina.
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robdab



Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 20
Location: Toronto, Canada

PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2009 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the chemical warfare info. I am also chasing down some further data on the US Army's Chemical Warfare Service's pre-Dec.7th efforts on Oahu. I hope to have more to share when you return here.

Kaneoheboy wrote:
I will be offline for awhile due to a eye surgery for a torn retina.

Am sorry to read that. If it provides any peace of mind, my similar episode took but two weeks to fully heal. Just rememeber, NO SURFING, (wet or keyboard) till your eye dr. says its ok ...

I will pass the time till you are recovered by ordering a full set of the Oahu RCWs. I believe that you had previously indicated that the Oahu Tour notes prepared by the CDSG a few years ago were good too but I have wondered if there is much duplication between the two, or not ?

Perhaps someone else from the CDSG could let me know while you are away on "sick call" ?
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Kaneoheboy



Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 42
Location: Kaneohe, HI

PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 2:34 am    Post subject: Oahu Defenses Reply with quote

Hi Rob, I think that the set of RCWs contains more data than the conference notes; although I have both. The back issue articles of the Journal on CD and DVD are full of info that you may find of interest.

Still on the mend, saw your photos on Facebook, good job! Smile

-John
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robdab



Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 20
Location: Toronto, Canada

PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2009 3:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Oahu Defenses Reply with quote

Kaneoheboy wrote:
Still on the mend, saw your photos on Facebook, good job! Smile -John


Glad to know that you are recovering but alas, the facebook effort was not mine.

robdab
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Kaneoheboy



Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 42
Location: Kaneohe, HI

PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2009 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oops, was it Flickr.com? I get them mixed up. Surprised -John
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robdab



Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 20
Location: Toronto, Canada

PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2009 3:28 am    Post subject: Oahu's WW2 Coastal Defences ? Reply with quote

John,

Are you recovered enough from your eye surgery to start playing "20 questions" about Oahu's WW2 coastal defences once again ?

robdab
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Kaneoheboy



Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 42
Location: Kaneohe, HI

PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2009 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll try my best, am quite busy at the moment. Smile
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robdab



Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 20
Location: Toronto, Canada

PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2009 6:03 pm    Post subject: 20 Questions On Oahu's CAC Defenses ? Reply with quote

John,

Perhaps it would be better then if I waited a bit longer before restarting the Warships1 "free fire zone" thread on invading Oahu ?

Would a week (or two) make it any easier to satisfy all of the demands on your time ?

robdab

PS - I assume that your eye surgery went well ?
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Kaneoheboy



Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 42
Location: Kaneohe, HI

PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2009 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fire away! I'll answer as best I can. Don't forget that Bill Gaines is one of the gurus having to do with Hawaii's coast artillery history, and has written numerous articles on the subjact as well. -John
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